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The last few pounds can come off!



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 4th, 2004, 05:01 PM
curt
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Posts: n/a
Default The last few pounds can come off!

I just wanted to mention that I am back on Induction for this week and it is
paying off. I am down to 180. I have been between 182-3 for a couple of
months (at least!) and am trying to make this month the month to end this
part of the journey. Carol Ann is a help in making my goal public as well.
I didn't make it last time, but hope to change this.

Just wanted to share my excitement. Only 3 pounds to go.

I do have a couple of hurdles this month. I am going on a 62 mile bicycle
ride this Sunday and I will need some carbs for that and next weekend I am
going on the MS 150 (150 mile two day ride with plenty of hills) and I will
need carbs for that. I would try them with LC, but I have already done this
and it is too hard when you are riding those distances. I can ride 40 miles
on LC, but after that I am really hurting and seem to hit a wall.

It can be done!
Curt

--
Started low carb May '03 this time.
211/180/177 . . 6'2" 15% BF?
Age 38
Highest weight 250 5+ years ago


  #2  
Old June 4th, 2004, 05:08 PM
Bob in CT
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Default The last few pounds can come off!

On Fri, 04 Jun 2004 16:01:51 GMT, curt wrote:

I just wanted to mention that I am back on Induction for this week and
it is
paying off. I am down to 180. I have been between 182-3 for a couple of
months (at least!) and am trying to make this month the month to end
this
part of the journey. Carol Ann is a help in making my goal public as
well.
I didn't make it last time, but hope to change this.

Just wanted to share my excitement. Only 3 pounds to go.

I do have a couple of hurdles this month. I am going on a 62 mile
bicycle
ride this Sunday and I will need some carbs for that and next weekend I
am
going on the MS 150 (150 mile two day ride with plenty of hills) and I
will
need carbs for that. I would try them with LC, but I have already done
this
and it is too hard when you are riding those distances. I can ride 40
miles
on LC, but after that I am really hurting and seem to hit a wall.

It can be done!
Curt


I wouldn't worry too much about it. I went on the MS ride here (55, 60
miles), and ate some carbs during the ride, each day, then ate all the
pizza and other carb-heavy stuff (until breakfast, when I was able to have
eggs and meat). I still lost weight. When you're biking that much, a few
carbs won't hurt at all.

--
Bob in CT
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  #3  
Old June 4th, 2004, 05:16 PM
TavliGal
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Posts: n/a
Default The last few pounds can come off!

curt wrote:
I just wanted to mention that I am back on Induction for this week
and it is paying off. I am down to 180. I have been between 182-3
for a couple of months (at least!) and am trying to make this month
the month to end this part of the journey. Carol Ann is a help in
making my goal public as well. I didn't make it last time, but hope
to change this.

Just wanted to share my excitement. Only 3 pounds to go.

I do have a couple of hurdles this month. I am going on a 62 mile
bicycle ride this Sunday and I will need some carbs for that and
next weekend I am going on the MS 150 (150 mile two day ride with
plenty of hills) and I will need carbs for that. I would try them
with LC, but I have already done this and it is too hard when you
are riding those distances. I can ride 40 miles on LC, but after
that I am really hurting and seem to hit a wall.

It can be done!
Curt

--
Started low carb May '03 this time.
211/180/177 . . 6'2" 15% BF?
Age 38
Highest weight 250 5+ years ago


Best of luck Curt! I'm rooting for you.
Monica
--
Started 01/20/04
362/297.6/Goal: till my thighs don't rub together anymore
__________________________________________________ ______
"Continuous effort - not strength or intelligence - is the key to
unlocking our potential."
- Winston Churchill



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  #4  
Old June 4th, 2004, 05:18 PM
Roger Zoul
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Posts: n/a
Default The last few pounds can come off!

Just remember, the carbs alone aren't the problem...but if you eat more than
you burn off you might gain weight, or not lose any.

Good luck....

Oh, I'm doing a puny 35-mile charity ride tomorrow...still trying to learn
the clipless pedals. I haven't fallen over since last Saturday so maybe I'm
getting the hang of them now.

curt wrote:
:: I just wanted to mention that I am back on Induction for this week
:: and it is paying off. I am down to 180. I have been between 182-3
:: for a couple of months (at least!) and am trying to make this month
:: the month to end this part of the journey. Carol Ann is a help in
:: making my goal public as well. I didn't make it last time, but hope
:: to change this.
::
:: Just wanted to share my excitement. Only 3 pounds to go.
::
:: I do have a couple of hurdles this month. I am going on a 62 mile
:: bicycle ride this Sunday and I will need some carbs for that and
:: next weekend I am going on the MS 150 (150 mile two day ride with
:: plenty of hills) and I will need carbs for that. I would try them
:: with LC, but I have already done this and it is too hard when you
:: are riding those distances. I can ride 40 miles on LC, but after
:: that I am really hurting and seem to hit a wall.
::
:: It can be done!
:: Curt
::
:: --
:: Started low carb May '03 this time.
:: 211/180/177 . . 6'2" 15% BF?
:: Age 38
:: Highest weight 250 5+ years ago


  #5  
Old June 4th, 2004, 05:35 PM
Bob in CT
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Posts: n/a
Default The last few pounds can come off!

On Fri, 4 Jun 2004 12:18:09 -0400, Roger Zoul
wrote:

Just remember, the carbs alone aren't the problem...but if you eat more
than
you burn off you might gain weight, or not lose any.

Good luck....

Oh, I'm doing a puny 35-mile charity ride tomorrow...still trying to
learn
the clipless pedals. I haven't fallen over since last Saturday so maybe
I'm
getting the hang of them now.


That's about what I'm riding tomorrow -- 30 miles. I'm still building
up.

You'll learn the clipless, and they'll become second nature.

--
Bob in CT
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  #6  
Old June 6th, 2004, 03:05 PM
Roger Zoul
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Posts: n/a
Default The last few pounds can come off!

CarbAddict wrote:
::: From: Roger Zoul (Fri, 4 Jun 2004 12:18:09 -0400)
::: MsgId:
:::
::: Just remember, the carbs alone aren't the problem...but if you
::: eat more than you burn off you might gain weight, or not lose any.
::
:: It is difficult to imagine eating enough over two days to counteract
:: a 150-mile ride. I'm not saying a person can't do it, but it'd take
:: real commitment.

Not really. All it takes just getting hungry. It is very easy to eat a lot
of calories in a very short amount of time, much less time than it takes to
do a 150-mile ride. And if you know you're going to be riding, there is a
tendency to eat in preparation, since on these kinds of rides you definitely
don't want to "bonk".

:: I can burn off my day's calories (low carb or not)
:: by running for a couple of hours.

And you can consume that amount of calories you burn in a couple hours of
running in less than a minute.


At an average of 10mph, he's
:: looking at almost 8 hours of riding per day if he has to do 150
:: miles over two days.

He'll do it in less time than that.

::
:: --
:: In other words, it ain't happening.


  #7  
Old June 6th, 2004, 03:08 PM
Roger Zoul
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Posts: n/a
Default The last few pounds can come off!

CarbAddict wrote:
::: From: Bob in CT (Fri, 04 Jun 2004 16:08:44 GMT)
::: MsgId:
:::
::: When you're biking that much, a few
::: carbs won't hurt at all.
::
:: If the purpose of LC'ing is weight management, I completely agree.
:: It is slightly different if the purpose is blood sugar management.

The context is riding a lot of miles, not weight management or BG control.
Of course, with that amount of effort, BG won't be much of a problem either,
unless the diabetic has really poor control and such a person probably won't
be doing 150-mile bike rides.


  #8  
Old June 7th, 2004, 10:27 AM
Roger Zoul
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Posts: n/a
Default The last few pounds can come off!

CarbAddict wrote:
::::: From: Roger Zoul (Fri, 4 Jun 2004 12:18:09 -0400)
::::: MsgId:
:::::
::::: Just remember, the carbs alone aren't the problem...but if you
::::: eat more than you burn off you might gain weight, or not lose any.
::
:::: CarbAddict wrote:
::::
:::: It is difficult to imagine eating enough over two days
:::: to counteract a 150-mile ride. I'm not saying a person
:::: can't do it, but it'd take real commitment.
::
::: From: Roger Zoul (Sun, 6 Jun 2004 10:05:28 -0400)
::: MsgId:
:::
::: Not really.
::
:: If you really want to debate the point, let's establish some
:: boundaries. How many calories do you think he'll burn over a
:: 150-mile ride? If we're going to talk "it is easy to eat that many
:: calories" we should come to some basic understanding of what "that
:: many calories" is.

Okay....I'd guess that he'd average 15 mph....so he'd probably take 10 hours
to complete ride. He weighs about 180 lbs so he'll burn about 4700 kcals.
So on each day of a two-day ride he'll use about 2350 kcals.

::
::: All it takes just getting hungry.
::
:: Perhaps it is subjective but at the level of calories we're talking,
:: I've never been that hungry in my life. I don't see a guy who has
:: dieted to get down to 180 lbs or so getting that hungry either --
:: especially during a ride. All told, I tend to eat LESS when I'm
:: exercising that heavily.

He doesn't necessarily have to eat this during the ride.(I would not do
that!).....there is before and after the event, and some during the event.
If the doesn't get enough carbs, he can suffer from low blood sugar event
during and after a day of riding. Eating a lot of food during exercise is
not helpful at all. But not bonking is enough to bring on a committment,
and this is a two-day ride, so that's 80 miles one day followed up by 70
miles the next. If you don't have a committment, you might well get in
trouble on day two.

And just because you've never been hungry enough to wolf down 2300 kcals....

::
:: Give us an example of how someone who knows about calories and
:: eating right eating, say, 2000-3000 calories a day while riding 75
:: miles/day.

I don't understand what you're asking.


::
::: It is very easy to eat a lot of calories in a very short
::: amount of time, much less time than it takes to do a 150-mile
::: ride.
::
:: We'll come back to this when you've established how many calories
:: you're thinking. I say he'll spend most of his time riding and
:: recovering, not stuffing his face.

If he's riding 5 hours, what makes you think he has to spend a lot of time
stuffing his face to get some calories? He simply has to stop at a rest
stop and eat a three or four cookies, some fruit, and drink something carby.
And if he planned right, he ate some extra the day or evening before.


::
::: And if you know you're going to be riding, there is a
::: tendency to eat in preparation, since on these kinds
::: of rides you definitely don't want to "bonk".
::
:: True. But I doubt most people embarking on something like this sit
:: down and eat a few Big Macs. I know I don't. I also don't see
:: anything that leads me to believe curt will.

Why? I wouldn't pick Big Macs, but he could have pancakes with syrup, rice,
pasta, or any number of other things. Plus what he eats during the ride.
There is also a strong tendency to complete such events with a decent time,
so one doesn't want to go at a snells pace (well, on a first event one
might be content to finish, but on group rides you tend to go faster to keep
pace with other riders). Also, your other activities play into this as
well, and curt exercises a lot.


::
:::: I can burn off my day's calories (low carb or not)
:::: by running for a couple of hours.
::
::: And you can consume that amount of calories you burn in a
::: couple hours of running in less than a minute.
::
:: No, I can't. Even when I'm not controlling my diet, I wouldn't.

Wouldn't and can't have different meanings.

In
:: my worst of dreams, I'd down two Whoppers, some fries, and a drink.

2 whoppers, 1400 kcals, large coke, 330, large fries, 500 kcals. 2230 kcals
in one meal.

:: Or maybe a whole medium thin crust pizza. Again, this is if I'm in
:: total give-a-crap mode. Even eating like that, I can burn off the
:: number of calories in a 2-hr run. FYI, I burn about 1,000 calories
:: an hour running.

Get a pint of good ice cream.

What's your weight and how fast do you run a mile?


::
:: But let's get back to curt. Maybe there's something in his history I
:: haven't seen. Lord knows I don't read every post. Still, when I se
:: his level of fitness (based on the exercising he says he does) and
:: where he's come from, I just don't see it.

Curt loves pizza and beer. He talks about it all the time. He'd be wise to
eat plenty the evening after day one.

::
:::: At an average of 10mph, he's looking at almost 8 hours of
:::: riding per day if he has to do 150 miles over two days.
::
::: He'll do it in less time than that.
::
:: I don't know what his time will be. If you do, feel free to
:: establish is as a baseline for our discussion. I picked a 10 mph
:: average as a safe estimate given the distance, and without knowing
:: the terrain or weather conditions.

I'm guessing that he's a lot faster than I am since I'm 50 to 60 lbs heavier
than he is and he's been at it longer than I have. I really ride a lot of
hills and I can do a good bit better than 10 mph over 50 miles.


  #9  
Old June 7th, 2004, 08:50 PM
Roger Zoul
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default The last few pounds can come off!

CarbAddict wrote:
::::::: From: Roger Zoul (Fri, 4 Jun 2004 12:18:09 -0400)
::::::: MsgId:
:::::::
::::::: Just remember, the carbs alone aren't the problem...
::::::: but if you eat more than you burn off you might gain
::::::: weight, or not lose any.
::
:::::: CarbAddict wrote:
::::::
:::::: It is difficult to imagine eating enough over two days
:::::: to counteract a 150-mile ride. I'm not saying a person
:::::: can't do it, but it'd take real commitment.
::
::::: From: Roger Zoul (Sun, 6 Jun 2004 10:05:28 -0400)
::::: MsgId:
:::::
::::: Not really.
::
:::: CarbAddict wrote:
::::
:::: If you really want to debate the point, let's establish some
:::: boundaries. How many calories do you think he'll burn over a
:::: 150-mile ride? If we're going to talk "it is easy to eat that many
:::: calories" we should come to some basic understanding of what "that
:::: many calories" is.
::
::: From: Roger Zoul (Mon, 7 Jun 2004 05:27:53 -0400)
::: MsgId:
:::
::: Okay....I'd guess that he'd average 15 mph....so he'd probably
::: take 10 hours to complete ride. He weighs about 180 lbs so he'll
::: burn about 4700 kcals. So on each day of a two-day ride he'll
::: use about 2350 kcals.
::
:: Thanks. Now we can both talk apricots. I think it is easy for him to
:: burn more calories depending on wind and terrain, but we'll use your
:: numbers.

Sure....impossible to predict...

::
::::: All it takes just getting hungry.
::
:::: Perhaps it is subjective but at the level of calories we're
:::: talking, I've never been that hungry in my life. I don't see a guy
:::: who has dieted to get down to 180 lbs or so getting that hungry
:::: either -- especially during a ride. All told, I tend to eat LESS
:::: when I'm exercising that heavily.
::
::: He doesn't necessarily have to eat this during the ride. (I
::: would not do that!).....there is before and after the event,
::: and some during the event. If the doesn't get enough carbs,
::: he can suffer from low blood sugar event during and after a
::: day of riding. Eating a lot of food during exercise is not
::: helpful at all. But not bonking is enough to bring on a
::: committment, and this is a two-day ride, so that's 80 miles
::: one day followed up by 70 miles the next. If you don't have
::: a committment, you might well get in trouble on day two.
::
:: Eat more carby food, yes. Gorge on high-calorie food, no.

Right...I agree.

::
::: And just because you've never been hungry enough to wolf down 2300
::: kcals....
::
:: ... doesn't mean nobody else has. I get that.
::
:: Anything I post is going to contain some subjective experience as
:: well as things I consider to be objective (they may or may not be).
:: In the cases where I'm aware of subjective influence at work, I
:: don't mind pointing it out. I don't consider myself the healthiest
:: of eaters. I'm not a WFFID, but I am a person who grew up eating
:: junk food. Even though I've not eaten that way in 10 years, that
:: person is still in there. French fries are still my favorite food.
:: So while I realize there are people with worse eating habits (if
:: left unchecked) than I have lurking within, when I think back to my
:: dark days,

You sound like my twin

I could barely do it then. In fact, in my dark days, I
:: ate outrageously and never gained weight because I burned it.
:: There's just no way _I_ can eat like that when I'm exercising and
:: eating right. I'd get sick and toss my cookies first.

Now you sound like my opposite

::
:: My slant on this is curt wasn't asking about pumping himself with
:: high- calorie junk food like ice cream. He was talking about
:: higher-carb food like fruit, pasta, potatoes, etc.

Perhaps I have a slightly different view of how he likes to eat, since i'm
frequently in threads with him because we both love to bicycle.

::
::::: It is very easy to eat a lot of calories in a very short amount
::::: of time, much less time than it takes to do a 150-mile ride.
::
:::: We'll come back to this when you've established how many calories
:::: you're thinking. I say he'll spend most of his time riding and
:::: recovering, not stuffing his face.
::
::: If he's riding 5 hours, what makes you think he has to spend
::: a lot of time stuffing his face to get some calories? He
::: simply has to stop at a rest stop and eat a three or four
::: cookies, some fruit, and drink something carby. And if he
::: planned right, he ate some extra the day or evening before.
::
:: I see where you're coming from. You're saying if he tossed
:: everything he's learned about eating right and filled himself with
:: high-calorie stuff, he might consume more than he burns.

Well, my original statement in this thread was more to remind him that it
was calories moreso than carbs that he has to worry about. Hence, he can
eat the carby stuff and maybe gain water weight, but as long as he doesn't
overeat calories there isn't much worry.


I didn't
:: see him asking that type of question. Curt's already proven to me he
:: knows how to eat right (whether he always does or not). The only
:: thing I saw him pondering was the impact of carbing up on _FOOD_
:: (not cookies, etc.).

At rest stops they usually have lot for cookies, fruit, etc. Easy stuff.
Also, certain foods might fill your belly but they may not get digested
quickly enough to provide energy during a ride.

::
:: Did you see his other post where he talked about eating a banana,
:: etc.? That's what I'm thinking. He's not talking eating 20 of them
:: either.
::
:: Given that, my position is that he can go ahead and carb up for the
:: ride as it won't make any difference. I don't see any indication
:: that he plans to overeat. It is a valid warning to give him, but as
:: I said before, if he's eating, say, 2,000 calories/day now, and he
:: jumps to 3,000 for the ride, I'd be _very_ surprised if he gained
:: weight. The fact that those additional calories come in more carby
:: food is likely to have no discernable impact.

Well, that was my original point to curt. But, one can still eat a lot of
food (pizza, beer, cake -- stuff that curt likes to eat) and possibly gain
weight, especially if you're not counting everything. But if you mainly eat
carbs and don't overeat them, you likely won't gain fat, just water.

::
::::: And if you know you're going to be riding, there is a
::::: tendency to eat in preparation, since on these kinds
::::: of rides you definitely don't want to "bonk".
::
:::: True. But I doubt most people embarking on something
:::: like this sit down and eat a few Big Macs. I know I
:::: don't. I also don't see anything that leads me to
:::: believe curt will.
::
::: Why? I wouldn't pick Big Macs, but he could have pancakes
::: with syrup, rice, pasta, or any number of other things.
::
:: Most of what you named, while high-carb, isn't very high-calorie.
:: Again, I saw curt as asking about eating different types of foods,
:: not necessarily more. I have to bring the discussion back to that.
:: My position is that if he wants to eat 200 calories of rice instead
:: of 200 calories of steak, it will likely not hurt him. Do you
:: disagree?

200 calories of rice might help his glycogen stores, whereas the same
calories from steak probably won't. Depending on how he does his right, one
might help moreso than the other, but both can have a positive impact (fat
from the steak would fuel the aerobic system, so as long as he stays with a
certain intensity level, it helps) But as long as he doesn't overeat,
neither will hurt him.

::
:::::: I can burn off my day's calories (low carb or not)
:::::: by running for a couple of hours.
::
::::: And you can consume that amount of calories you burn in a
::::: couple hours of running in less than a minute.
::
:::: No, I can't. Even when I'm not controlling my diet, I wouldn't.
::
::: Wouldn't and can't have different meanings.
::
:: Agreed. However, you're establishing a baseline of the worst someone
:: could possibly do as opposed to normal and expected behavior.

I don't know about that...people who exercise a lot know they can get away
with more. So normal and expected, I think, becomes a moving target (at
least it does with me). Also, I don't consider it necessarily "worse".

::
:::: In my worst of dreams, I'd down two Whoppers, some fries,
:::: and a drink.
::
::: 2 whoppers, 1400 kcals, large coke, 330, large fries, 500 kcals.
::: 2230 kcals in one meal.
::
:: I'm trying to play along. I do not eat like that.

I'm not suggesting you do...I was just doing a quick count...that one meal,
which might not be that unrealistic for someone who just completed a hard
ride and who frequently exercises (don't consider one ride as an isolated
event - -I do at least 4 a week) might conceivably have appetite for it. I
know I could...even thought I doubt I would eat that if I had other options.

In fact, I'm not
:: sure I even "can" eat like that anymore (without getting sick).
:: There's no reason to believe this is what curt is talking about.

Hmm...curt talks frequently about his pizza and beer, and cake and stuff.
He exercises a lot, though, to compensate. Hence, his weight is stable.


:: Note that I'm not saying NOBODY could eat like that. I know people
:: can and do. I just haven't seen that in any of curt's posts. As I
:: said, it could have been in posts I haven't read.

Well, I might be misreading him too, but obviously I see him a little
differently than you...

::
:::: Or maybe a whole medium thin crust pizza. Again, this is if I'm in
:::: total give-a-crap mode. Even eating like that, I can burn off the
:::: number of calories in a 2-hr run. FYI, I burn about 1,000 calories
:::: an hour running.
::
::: Get a pint of good ice cream.
::
:: I'm partial to Breyer's Butter Pecan, but since most folks seem to
:: think Ben & Jerry's is "it", I'll use that. Serving size is 1/2 cup,
:: calories is 290. 290x4 servings in a pint = 1,160. I can burn that
:: off in an hour.

And you can eat it in a couple of minutes if you're hungry...so it takes 30
times the effort to burn what you can eat in two minutes.

::
:: We're getting off track, though. I'm sure people can do all kinds of
:: extreme things. I don't think that's what curt was pondering for his
:: ride.

You call that extreme, I call it more like typical...

::
:::: But let's get back to curt. Maybe there's something in
:::: his history I haven't seen. Lord knows I don't read
:::: every post. Still, when I se his level of fitness (based
:::: on the exercising he says he does) and where he's come
:::: from, I just don't see it.
::
::: Curt loves pizza and beer. He talks about it all the time.
::: He'd be wise to eat plenty the evening after day one.
::
:: I've seen debates here about just when readily-available carbs are
:: necessary. I haven't researched the topic, so I can't weigh in. What
:: I can say is if he needs more carbs, he should eat them without any
:: fear whatsoever about gaining weight. I stand convinced he will burn
:: them off during the ride (which was my original statement). If he
:: suddenly decides to scrap everything he knows about eating right and
:: go on the B&J ice cream diet of several pints/day, he may have
:: issues. I've not seen anything from him indicating that is his plan.

I think you misunderstood my original point. I was trying to say that carbs
aren't the problem, total calories are. So he should eat to support his
riding and not focus on strict LCing.... the other point about being
spurred on to eat was really tangential to the original point coming from
one (me) who likes to eat and can pack away some food once I develop an
appetite. Long (3+ hours) intense bike rides do that to me....

::
:: Thanks for the discussion.

It doesn't seem as if we really had much to disagree about....


 




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