View Single Post
  #17  
Old December 11th, 2012, 11:55 PM posted to alt.support.diet.low-carb
Doug Freyburger
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,866
Default Benefits of ketogenic diets

Susan wrote:
Doug Freyburger wrote:

... Because low
carbing has us not hungry, so it might have monkeys not hungry and, so I
thought until the results of that study came out, have also resulted in
longevity benefits.


I have never had appetite suppression by low carb. Lessening, perhaps,
but I am often hungry when I should not be.


That sucks. You're hungry when on low fat and hungry when on low carb.

I think a
higher pecentage of the population are not hungry while low carbing than
while low fatting but I am not aware of any study done to confirm that
opinion.


Seriously? You haven't seen those studies where low carbers were told
to eat until satisfied and low fatters stuck to low cal and lost half
the weight on 50% less calories? Start with the Schneider Peds study.


Those studies do not report who was hungry. They report who ate how
many calories and who lost how much.

I think it true but would need studies to be certain it's
true. I do know that some are constantly hungry while low carbing the
way I was constantly hungry while I was low fatting.


There have been studies, have you never sought them out?


Where are the studies that report on hunger levels? They are not the
studies were free eating low carbers lost at first better and and later
as well as calorie restricted low fatters.

Before you mentioned cortisol I do not believe any major figure in the
low carb field addressed the topic with any significant effort.


Nope, and certainly not Dr. Atkins. In fact, his suggestion of a fat
fast for resistant dieters would allow cortisol to rise even more due to
lowered insulin levels (high insulin levels lower adrenal steroid
synthesis and also CBG, the cortisol transport protein).


To me your interest in the topic of cortisol triggers a major advance in
the understanding of low carb metabolism. It added a deeper
understanding for me when I studied the topic.

One of the several arguments lodged against low carbing is that going
very low effects cortisol levels and that change in cortisol levels
causes irritability that drives people off low carbing.


I was a jittery, sleepless, anxious mess for three weeks, but I stuck
with it and adapted.


Yikes. When I went through my first Induction I was a jittery sleepless
mess for a couple of day then I adjusted.

The problem with that argument is it boils down to most/all low carbers
staying at Induction levels. Which is yet another reason why I stress
that "following the directions" includes not digging for excuses to stay
on phase 1 of a 4 phase process.


One doesn't need an excuse when Dr. Atkins said in his book that there's
nothing wrong with staying at induction levels if one is content and all
is going well. He was right. The "if" matters.


The "if" matters. It's also ignored by some here who deny that anyone
stalls starting about day 15 when they stay at 20. I've seen very many
people reporting that. It happens.

When I started low carbing my dosage was not changed
but as it mentions in the Atkins book I entered a permanent stall 6
months after I switched from "stay near CCLL" to "dig for excuses to
stay lower". I did 6 months doing a lock step process to find my CCLL
and stick to it and during that 6 months I lost 40 pounds. Very fast
results. Then I spent 6 months at 30 because 30 is easy and I didn't
lose a pound. That's when I started going back through forum archives
finding dozens or hundreds who had stalled by staying at 20 and I
started studying T3 levels.


Except for that month or two, I've never needed thyroid meds. Most
folks do much better on a natural thyroid meds or others with both T3
and T4...


I was put on generic for Synthroid around 10 years before I started low
carbing. It always worked well for me and there was no apparent change
in that when I started low carbing.

Thanks for the educational discussion! Always good to disagree with
you. It keeps my thinking sharp and my ideas evolving.