Is this really low-carb?

[MEow]

I hope you can bear with some newbie questions. I've already looked at the
FAQ for answers to this, but I didn't find it.

Since I've switched from a job where I natually walk and climb stairs a
lot, to one where I just sit on my butt and answer the phone, the
aforementioned butt has grown (well actually - it's mostly my wasteline;
which is the worst place to have too much - pear shaped would've been
better). I don't like that. I also think that my diet is way too carb-
heavy, as it is.

I'm vegetarian, but much to my joy I've found the book "Low-carb vegetarian
cooking" by Sue Spitler, but it puzzles me that it allows for instance
oatmeal as part of breakfast. Can that really be true? It also recommends
not going below 130 grams of carbs per day, as going lower can damage you
in the long run. True/False?

Well - I want to give this diet a try, starting tomorrow, but does it
belong in this ng?

If not I'll get out of you hair and just thank you for the link to the
Nutrient Data Laboratory, but if it does I'll probably return later with
more questions.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[lynn.redhead@gmail.com]

READ Atkins book for low carb meat eating dieting....
look somewhere else for low carb vegetarian diets...
ain't gonna find advice here....
(:
Lynn

[Aramanth Dawe]

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 12:51:35 +0000 (UTC), MEow >
wrote:

>I'm vegetarian, but much to my joy I've found the book "Low-carb vegetarian
>cooking" by Sue Spitler, but it puzzles me that it allows for instance
>oatmeal as part of breakfast. Can that really be true? It also recommends
>not going below 130 grams of carbs per day, as going lower can damage you
>in the long run. True/False?

Personally, I do a LOT better on around 30 - 50g of carb. You might
do differently. I'd recommend looking at other Plans, or at least
look at Atkins or Protein Power to get an idea of the kind of carb
restriction many find necessary in the short term. Yes, you CAN do
even very restrictive levels of Atkins as a vegetarian if you're
willing to accept that your food sources will be limited.

>Well - I want to give this diet a try, starting tomorrow, but does it
>belong in this ng?
>
>If not I'll get out of you hair and just thank you for the link to the
>Nutrient Data Laboratory, but if it does I'll probably return later with
>more questions.
>
>Kind regards,
>Nikitta.

I'm guessing you're looking for
http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/search/ which is the USDA data
base, a most useful tool.

I'd also suggest you look at http://www.immuneweb.org/lowcarb/
Cyndi (the web owner) was a very active member here at one time and
has come up with some useful resources for vegetarian low-carbers.
For long-term members, you might also be pleased to hear that she is a
new mother, having given birth to a healthy baby girl in February.

Aramanth

[lynn.redhead@gmail.com]

Oatmeal is not low carb....LOL

[MEow]

Lynn spoke thusly:

> READ Atkins book for low carb meat eating dieting....
> look somewhere else for low carb vegetarian diets...
> ain't gonna find advice here....
> (:

Well - it seems it isn't then, so I'll just leave again, but thanks for the
replies.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[jbuch]

MEow wrote:


> I'm vegetarian, but much to my joy I've found the book "Low-carb vegetarian
> cooking" by Sue Spitler, but it puzzles me that it allows for instance
> oatmeal as part of breakfast. Can that really be true? It also recommends
> not going below 130 grams of carbs per day, as going lower can damage you
> in the long run. True/False?
>


There is a school of thought that says that you need to consume 100
grams or more of carbohydrates each day because the brain burns
carbohydrates....... and therefore you must eat them for your brain.

This ignores the fact that your kidneys convert protein into
carbohydrates. And this converted protein quite nicely feeds your brain.

Your body is not like an automobile..... where it burns only gasoline
because it has no mechanism to convert oil (or diesel fuel) to gasoline,
for example.

Your body has evolved to run pretty well on miserably crappy fuels of
many kinds.

Just look at the wide range of foods and food supplies around the globe
and through history.

Mandkind did not evolve from (with) grocery stores with fresh and frozen
foods from all over the world available at your fingertips.

[Luna]

In article 8>,
MEow > wrote:

> I hope you can bear with some newbie questions. I've already looked at the
> FAQ for answers to this, but I didn't find it.
>
> Since I've switched from a job where I natually walk and climb stairs a
> lot, to one where I just sit on my butt and answer the phone, the
> aforementioned butt has grown (well actually - it's mostly my wasteline;
> which is the worst place to have too much - pear shaped would've been
> better). I don't like that. I also think that my diet is way too carb-
> heavy, as it is.
>
> I'm vegetarian, but much to my joy I've found the book "Low-carb vegetarian
> cooking" by Sue Spitler, but it puzzles me that it allows for instance
> oatmeal as part of breakfast. Can that really be true? It also recommends
> not going below 130 grams of carbs per day, as going lower can damage you
> in the long run. True/False?
>
> Well - I want to give this diet a try, starting tomorrow, but does it
> belong in this ng?
>
> If not I'll get out of you hair and just thank you for the link to the
> Nutrient Data Laboratory, but if it does I'll probably return later with
> more questions.
>
> Kind regards,
> Nikitta.

First off, low-carb isn't the only way to lose weight to start with, so
of course you could lose on 130g per day. I have no idea if it's
unhealthy to go below that, but I would guess that it isn't, based
purely on anecdotal evidence from this group.

Losing weight is all about eating less than you use. Imo, low-carb
works mostly because it helps reduce appetite. Do certain carb heavy
foods trigger you to eat more? If so, just don't eat those foods.
Potatoes, rice, corn, wheat, and sugar are the usual culprits.

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article . com>,
wrote:

> READ Atkins book for low carb meat eating dieting....
> look somewhere else for low carb vegetarian diets...
> ain't gonna find advice here....

Why is that? This is not alt.support.diet.atkins. There are lots of
ways of low-carbing represented in this newsgroup.

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[Marengo]

MEow wrote:
|| I hope you can bear with some newbie questions. I've already looked
|| at the FAQ for answers to this, but I didn't find it.
||
|| Since I've switched from a job where I natually walk and climb
|| stairs a lot, to one where I just sit on my butt and answer the
|| phone, the aforementioned butt has grown (well actually - it's
|| mostly my wasteline; which is the worst place to have too much -
|| pear shaped would've been better). I don't like that. I also think
|| that my diet is way too carb- heavy, as it is.
||
|| I'm vegetarian, but much to my joy I've found the book "Low-carb
|| vegetarian cooking" by Sue Spitler, but it puzzles me that it allows
|| for instance oatmeal as part of breakfast. Can that really be true?
|| It also recommends not going below 130 grams of carbs per day, as
|| going lower can damage you in the long run. True/False?
||
|| Well - I want to give this diet a try, starting tomorrow, but does it
|| belong in this ng?
||
|| If not I'll get out of you hair and just thank you for the link to
|| the Nutrient Data Laboratory, but if it does I'll probably return
|| later with more questions.
||
|| Kind regards,
|| Nikitta.

As others have averred, 130 grams a day is too high to be considered "low
carb," and no, there is absolutely no evidence that going lower can damage
you in the long run. Those of us who eat under 40 or even under 20
experience amazing heart-healthy benefits such as lower cholesterol and
triglycerides, normalized blood sugars, lower blood presure and much more.

I did a quick Google search of "Low Carb Vegetarian Recipes" and it came
back with 795,000 results in .20 seconds! I'm surprised that you haven't
done the same already instead of limiting yourself to one book that doesn't
sound at all like the contents fit its name based on what you said.

Here are the results of the Google search; I'm sure you can find many, many
vegetarian recipes that you can use for variety if you're serious about
vegetarian low carb; there have been some people who pass through here that
have been successful on such a plan.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=low+carb+vegetarian+recipes&btnG=Google+Search

Out of curiosity, are you a vegetarian for religious reasons, or are you
just a PETA kin of gal?

Good luck to you,
--
Peter
Website: http://users.thelink.net/marengo

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article 8>,
MEow > wrote:

> Lynn spoke thusly:
>
> > READ Atkins book for low carb meat eating dieting....
> > look somewhere else for low carb vegetarian diets...
> > ain't gonna find advice here....
> > (:
>
> Well - it seems it isn't then, so I'll just leave again, but thanks for the
> replies.

Whoa! Don't let one idiot drive you away. Some of us hadn't even woken
up yet when you posted.

There's a popularly-believed myth out there about needing 130-160 grams
or so of carb a day, and it's just that -- a myth. What low-carbing
does is switch us over to burning fat instead of burning carbs for our
energy. That's what ketosis is.

I would be highly suspicious of the author of the book you're reading.
Oatmeal is NOT low-carb. Try using a resource like fitday.com to find
out the nutrient breakdown of various of your foods. You will generally
find that starchy foods (like rice, beans, peas, corn, carrots,
potatoes) have higher carb contents than do other plant products.

Do you do lacto-ovo? Or fish (although I've never understood how one
can be vegetarian and eat fish, oh, well!)? If you do, those should
make it easier to be a low-carb vegetarian.

Many low-carbers do rely heavily on meats, but it's not necessary. I
would be interested in following a thread on vegetarian low-carbing.
I'm omnivorous myself, but I enjoy creative cooking, and sometimes I
look like a vegetarian when it's just that it's been a few days since my
last steak. ;-)

Please hang around. This could be an interesting discussion.

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[Marengo]

jbuch wrote:
<snip>

|| This ignores the fact that your kidneys convert protein into
|| carbohydrates.


Huh?

--
Peter
Website: http://users.thelink.net/marengo

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article <8Oh%d.3521$%d7.529@lakeread03>,
"Marengo" > wrote:

> jbuch wrote:
> <snip>
>
> || This ignores the fact that your kidneys convert protein into
> || carbohydrates.
>
> Huh?

Dunno if it's the kidneys that do it, but over 50% of the protein we
ingest is converted to glucose. That's why my blood glucose goes up a
little when I eat a very low-carb high-protein meal. It's slower than
converting other carbs to glucose, but it does happen.

Priscilla, type 2 diabetic, diet & metformin, down 40 lbs since diagnosis
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[MEow]

Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:

> I would be highly suspicious of the author of the book you're reading.
> Oatmeal is NOT low-carb. Try using a resource like fitday.com to
> find out the nutrient breakdown of various of your foods. You will
> generally find that starchy foods (like rice, beans, peas, corn,
> carrots, potatoes) have higher carb contents than do other plant
> products.
>
I do know a few things about nutrition, and that's why it really baffeled
me when a book with that title would talk about oatmeal for breakfast,
but I decided to ask in here. It's not the only thing in that book, which
got that reaction from me, and some of the things she mentions seems to
be more about complex carbs than about low carb - but that's only AFAIK,
ICBW...etc...

It just bummed me so much because I was so excited when I found the book
online, and I ordered it - especially since she's writing it with a
doctor. Oh well - all in the name of selling, it seems :0(

> Do you do lacto-ovo? Or fish (although I've never understood how one
> can be vegetarian and eat fish, oh, well!)? If you do, those should
> make it easier to be a low-carb vegetarian.

I'm ovo-lacto. No fish for me, please. I really don't want to give that
up, but I also want to stop eating so carb-heavy.
>
> Many low-carbers do rely heavily on meats, but it's not necessary. I
> would be interested in following a thread on vegetarian low-carbing.
> I'm omnivorous myself, but I enjoy creative cooking, and sometimes I
> look like a vegetarian when it's just that it's been a few days since
> my last steak. ;-)
>
> Please hang around. This could be an interesting discussion.
>
I'll stick around for a bit and see.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Jennifer]

Priscilla Ballou wrote:

> Dunno if it's the kidneys that do it, but over 50% of the protein we
> ingest is converted to glucose. That's why my blood glucose goes up a
> little when I eat a very low-carb high-protein meal. It's slower than
> converting other carbs to glucose, but it does happen.
>
> Priscilla, type 2 diabetic, diet & metformin, down 40 lbs since diagnosis


It's important to remember that it's not the weight of the food
itself... but of the protein content of that food.

So if you eat 100g of a steak, only 20 - 25g of it is protein... and 58%
of that protein will convert to glucose.


Jennifer

[None Given]

"Marengo" > wrote in message
news:3Dh%d.3519$%d7.1873@lakeread03...
> Out of curiosity, are you a vegetarian for religious reasons, or are you
> just a PETA kin of gal?


There are people who are vegetarian because they don't like to eat meat or
it just doesn't agree with their digestive system.

--
No Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes

[Jeri]

wombn > wrote:
<snip>
> Wow. I don't know where the line is drawn "officially", but I'd never
> call 130 gm/day LOW carb!! Maybe they're lower than establishment
> medicine would recommend, but geez. That's stretching it a bit.

I've seen the figure less than 100g/day posted often as the cut off point. I
have no idea if that's 'official' or if it's just been repeated so many
times that it appears to be.
--
Jeri
"Change is inevitable, except from vending machines."

[The Queen of Cans and Jars]

Jeri > wrote:

> I've seen the figure less than 100g/day posted often as the cut off point. I
> have no idea if that's 'official' or if it's just been repeated so many
> times that it appears to be.

"Low-carbohydrate: less than 20% of total calories Note: a ketogenic
diet contains, by definition, less than 100 g carbs/day. But while all
ketogenic diets are low-carbohydrate, not all low-carbohydate diets are
ketogenic."

http://www.ironmagazine.com/printout136.html

[FOB]

Here's a site on Vegetarian Low Carbing.
http://www.immuneweb.org/lowcarb/

In 97.138,
MEow > stated
| I hope you can bear with some newbie questions. I've already looked
| at the FAQ for answers to this, but I didn't find it.
|
| Since I've switched from a job where I natually walk and climb stairs
| a lot, to one where I just sit on my butt and answer the phone, the
| aforementioned butt has grown (well actually - it's mostly my
| wasteline; which is the worst place to have too much - pear shaped
| would've been better). I don't like that. I also think that my diet
| is way too carb- heavy, as it is.
|
| I'm vegetarian, but much to my joy I've found the book "Low-carb
| vegetarian cooking" by Sue Spitler, but it puzzles me that it allows
| for instance oatmeal as part of breakfast. Can that really be true?
| It also recommends not going below 130 grams of carbs per day, as
| going lower can damage you in the long run. True/False?
|
| Well - I want to give this diet a try, starting tomorrow, but does it
| belong in this ng?
|
| If not I'll get out of you hair and just thank you for the link to the
| Nutrient Data Laboratory, but if it does I'll probably return later
| with more questions.
|
| Kind regards,
| Nikitta.

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article >,
Jennifer > wrote:

> Priscilla Ballou wrote:
>
> > Dunno if it's the kidneys that do it, but over 50% of the protein we
> > ingest is converted to glucose. That's why my blood glucose goes up a
> > little when I eat a very low-carb high-protein meal. It's slower than
> > converting other carbs to glucose, but it does happen.
> >
> > Priscilla, type 2 diabetic, diet & metformin, down 40 lbs since diagnosis
>
>
> It's important to remember that it's not the weight of the food
> itself... but of the protein content of that food.

I presume you don't think you're correcting me here.

> So if you eat 100g of a steak, only 20 - 25g of it is protein... and 58%
> of that protein will convert to glucose.

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article 8>,
MEow > wrote:
> Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:
> > I would be highly suspicious of the author of the book you're reading.
> > Oatmeal is NOT low-carb. Try using a resource like fitday.com to
> > find out the nutrient breakdown of various of your foods. You will
> > generally find that starchy foods (like rice, beans, peas, corn,
> > carrots, potatoes) have higher carb contents than do other plant
> > products.
> >
> I do know a few things about nutrition, and that's why it really baffeled
> me when a book with that title would talk about oatmeal for breakfast,
> but I decided to ask in here. It's not the only thing in that book, which
> got that reaction from me, and some of the things she mentions seems to
> be more about complex carbs than about low carb - but that's only AFAIK,
> ICBW...etc...
> It just bummed me so much because I was so excited when I found the book
> online, and I ordered it - especially since she's writing it with a
> doctor. Oh well - all in the name of selling, it seems :0(

There are idiot doctors just as there are idiot nutritionists, nuclear
scientists, journalists, politicians, etc. Sad but true.

Did you buy the book from someone who accepts returns?

> > Do you do lacto-ovo? Or fish (although I've never understood how one
> > can be vegetarian and eat fish, oh, well!)? If you do, those should
> > make it easier to be a low-carb vegetarian.
>
> I'm ovo-lacto. No fish for me, please. I really don't want to give that
> up, but I also want to stop eating so carb-heavy.

Gotcha. Ovo-lacto gives you lots of options. Compare carb contents of
cream vs milk and start converting recipes to use cream/water in place
of milk. Cheese is so versatile, as are creamy sauces, and so on. Plus
omelets! And of course all flavors of vegetarian are permitted tofu,
one of my favorite food staples. It's lovely and low-carb. As I said
to someone when I first got into eating lower carb as treatment for my
diabetes: who can complain about a way of eating that allows unlimited
garlic and mushrooms? :-)

If you start mourning beans, look into soy beans. Eden markets canned
black and regular soy beans which can substitute in for other kinds of
beans in many recipes. They are astonishingly low carb and quite tasty.
I have yet to try soaking and cooking dried soy beans, but it's on my
"to do" list.

> > Many low-carbers do rely heavily on meats, but it's not necessary. I
> > would be interested in following a thread on vegetarian low-carbing.
> > I'm omnivorous myself, but I enjoy creative cooking, and sometimes I
> > look like a vegetarian when it's just that it's been a few days since
> > my last steak. ;-)
> >
> > Please hang around. This could be an interesting discussion.
> >
> I'll stick around for a bit and see.

Good! :-)

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[Bob M]

On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:08:49 GMT, Priscilla Ballou >
wrote:

> In article >,
> Jennifer > wrote:
>
>> Priscilla Ballou wrote:
>>
>> > Dunno if it's the kidneys that do it, but over 50% of the protein we
>> > ingest is converted to glucose. That's why my blood glucose goes up a
>> > little when I eat a very low-carb high-protein meal. It's slower than
>> > converting other carbs to glucose, but it does happen.
>> >
>> > Priscilla, type 2 diabetic, diet & metformin, down 40 lbs since
>> diagnosis
>>
>>
>> It's important to remember that it's not the weight of the food
>> itself... but of the protein content of that food.
>
> I presume you don't think you're correcting me here.
>
>> So if you eat 100g of a steak, only 20 - 25g of it is protein... and 58%
>> of that protein will convert to glucose.


That's only if you're eating low carb. Above a certain carb intake, the
protein will not convert to glucose. So, if you're like I was on low fat
(basically a Pritikin-style diet) and eating hundreds of grams of carbs
per day, then protein won't convert to carbs.



--
Bob M
remove ".x" to reply

[FOB]

Black soy beans.

In ,
wombn > stated
| On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:18:40 GMT, Priscilla Ballou
| > wrote:
|
|| Eden markets canned
|| black and regular soy beans which can substitute in for other kinds
|| of beans in many recipes. They are astonishingly low carb and quite
|| tasty.
|
| wait a minutes.. BLACK beans? are they using a different cultivar
| than the USDA database?
|
| http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/cgi-bin/list_nut_edit.pl
|
|
| --
| --------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
|
| If laughter is the best medicine,
| then kittens should be covered by our health insurance. :-)

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article >,
wombn > wrote:

> On Sun, 20 Mar 2005 22:18:40 GMT, Priscilla Ballou
> > wrote:
>
> >Eden markets canned
> >black and regular soy beans which can substitute in for other kinds of
> >beans in many recipes. They are astonishingly low carb and quite tasty.
>
> wait a minutes.. BLACK beans? are they using a different cultivar
> than the USDA database?
>
> http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/cgi-bin/list_nut_edit.pl

Black SOY beans.

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[Marengo]

Priscilla Ballou wrote:
|| In article <8Oh%d.3521$%d7.529@lakeread03>,
|| "Marengo" > wrote:
||
||| jbuch wrote:
||| <snip>
|||
||||| This ignores the fact that your kidneys convert protein into
||||| carbohydrates.
|||
||| Huh?
||
|| Dunno if it's the kidneys that do it, but over 50% of the protein we
|| ingest is converted to glucose.

I wasn't questioning the protein conversion to glucose, I was questioning
the kidneys converting it. The kidneys act as filters; the liver acts as a
processor. AFAIK.
--
Peter
Website: http://users.thelink.net/marengo

[RRzVRR]

Marengo wrote:

> jbuch wrote:
> <snip>
>
> || This ignores the fact that your kidneys convert protein into
> || carbohydrates.
>
>
> Huh?
>

Ketones are produced by the liver. The kidneys can preform
gluconeogenesis under the right conditions, but gluconeogenesis
is mostly done by the liver as well.

--
Rudy - Remove the Z from my address to respond.

"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees!"
-Emiliano Zapata

Check out the a.s.d.l-c FAQ at:
http://www.grossweb.com/asdlc/faq.htm

[RRzVRR]

Jeri wrote:

> wombn > wrote:
> <snip>
>
>>Wow. I don't know where the line is drawn "officially", but I'd never
>>call 130 gm/day LOW carb!! Maybe they're lower than establishment
>>medicine would recommend, but geez. That's stretching it a bit.
>
>
> I've seen the figure less than 100g/day posted often as the cut off point. I
> have no idea if that's 'official' or if it's just been repeated so many
> times that it appears to be.

Under non-dieting, balanced intake conditions, the brain uses
around 100g of glucose a day.

--
Rudy - Remove the Z from my address to respond.

"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees!"
-Emiliano Zapata

Check out the a.s.d.l-c FAQ at:
http://www.grossweb.com/asdlc/faq.htm

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article <wot%d.3863$%d7.1483@lakeread03>,
"Marengo" > wrote:

> Priscilla Ballou wrote:
> || In article <8Oh%d.3521$%d7.529@lakeread03>,
> || "Marengo" > wrote:
> ||
> ||| jbuch wrote:
> ||| <snip>
> |||
> ||||| This ignores the fact that your kidneys convert protein into
> ||||| carbohydrates.
> |||
> ||| Huh?
> ||
> || Dunno if it's the kidneys that do it, but over 50% of the protein we
> || ingest is converted to glucose.
>
> I wasn't questioning the protein conversion to glucose, I was questioning
> the kidneys converting it. The kidneys act as filters; the liver acts as a
> processor. AFAIK.

OK. We're in agreement then.

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[MEow]

Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:

[The book "Low Carb vegetarian" not living up to it's name despite being
co-authored by a doctor]

> There are idiot doctors just as there are idiot nutritionists, nuclear
> scientists, journalists, politicians, etc. Sad but true.
>
> Did you buy the book from someone who accepts returns?
>
I could've returned it if I hadn't paid it already, but I was
stupid/thrilled enough to pay online before even opening it, so I'm not
sure if I can return it now - I'll check.

> Gotcha. Ovo-lacto gives you lots of options. Compare carb contents
> of cream vs milk and start converting recipes to use cream/water in
> place of milk. Cheese is so versatile, as are creamy sauces, and so
> on. Plus omelets! And of course all flavors of vegetarian are
> permitted tofu, one of my favorite food staples. It's lovely and
> low-carb. As I said to someone when I first got into eating lower
> carb as treatment for my diabetes: who can complain about a way of
> eating that allows unlimited garlic and mushrooms? :-)

I've looked into the link about introduction and printed the list of
vegetables that are okay, looked at the link for vegetarians for the list
of good protein sources and generally looked more into things. It did
surprise me that yoghurt naturell and milk is a no-no, but as I understand
it, it's only for 2 weeks.
>
> If you start mourning beans, look into soy beans. Eden markets canned
> black and regular soy beans which can substitute in for other kinds of
> beans in many recipes. They are astonishingly low carb and quite
> tasty. I have yet to try soaking and cooking dried soy beans, but
> it's on my "to do" list.

I'm used to soaking and cooking beans (I tend to cook a large amount and
put most in the freezer, because otherwise I'd never get around to it), and
I know that soy beans have the best Protein/carb ration, but I didn't know
if it would be okay. Good to know that it is. I've brought some roasted,
salted soy beans to work, to snack on.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Mogget]

In message >, Aramanth Dawe
> writes

>I'd also suggest you look at http://www.immuneweb.org/lowcarb/
>Cyndi (the web owner) was a very active member here at one time and
>has come up with some useful resources for vegetarian low-carbers.
>For long-term members, you might also be pleased to hear that she is a
>new mother, having given birth to a healthy baby girl in February.

Wow! I had missed that. How did you hear?
--
Mogget, the Churl in the Puce Greatcoat

[MEow]

Marengo spoke thusly:

> Here are the results of the Google search; I'm sure you can find many,
> many vegetarian recipes that you can use for variety if you're serious
> about vegetarian low carb; there have been some people who pass
> through here that have been successful on such a plan.
>
> http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=low+carb+vegetarian+recipes&btnG=G
> oogle+Search
>
Thanks. With the help I've found here, I'll go for it.

> Out of curiosity, are you a vegetarian for religious reasons, or are
> you just a PETA kin of gal?
>
Don't take it the wrong way, but I don't really feel like discussing that
in here.

> Good luck to you,

Thanks.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article 8>,
MEow > wrote:

> Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:

> I've looked into the link about introduction and printed the list of
> vegetables that are okay, looked at the link for vegetarians for the list
> of good protein sources and generally looked more into things. It did
> surprise me that yoghurt naturell and milk is a no-no, but as I understand
> it, it's only for 2 weeks.

Ah, yes, induction. Yoghurt is actually much lower in carbs than one
would think by reading the back of a container in the supermarket.
Those figures include what went *into* the yoghurt, not what's in the
cup you're eating from. The cultures digest much of the lactose and
turn it into lactic acid, which is where the zing comes from. That
reminds me. I have some milk to use up. I should toss some cream in
with it and get some yoghurt going.

After induction, you might want to experiment with yoghurt some.

> > If you start mourning beans, look into soy beans. Eden markets canned
> > black and regular soy beans which can substitute in for other kinds of
> > beans in many recipes. They are astonishingly low carb and quite
> > tasty. I have yet to try soaking and cooking dried soy beans, but
> > it's on my "to do" list.
>
> I'm used to soaking and cooking beans (I tend to cook a large amount and
> put most in the freezer, because otherwise I'd never get around to it), and

I do much the same, and then I end up with an over-full freezer I have
to eat. ;-)

> I know that soy beans have the best Protein/carb ration, but I didn't know
> if it would be okay. Good to know that it is. I've brought some roasted,
> salted soy beans to work, to snack on.

You need to know that I'm not doing Atkins or any other formal program.
To me, anything that's low-carb or otherwise doesn't register much on my
glucometer is OK by me, although dietary plans with names might not
agree with what I'm doing. I'm just a type 2 diabetic controlling my
blood glucose through controlled carb intake. I "eat to my meter." As
a side-effect, I've lost weight and I'm continuing to lose, but it's not
my primary goal.

Sounds like you're getting yourself oriented. Good stuff!

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[Aramanth Dawe]

On Mon, 21 Mar 2005 20:30:27 GMT, Mogget >
wrote:

>In message >, Aramanth Dawe
> writes
>
>>I'd also suggest you look at http://www.immuneweb.org/lowcarb/
>>Cyndi (the web owner) was a very active member here at one time and
>>has come up with some useful resources for vegetarian low-carbers.
>>For long-term members, you might also be pleased to hear that she is a
>>new mother, having given birth to a healthy baby girl in February.
>
>Wow! I had missed that. How did you hear?

I have a friend (from another list) who is a LC vegetarian and is on
the List from Cyndi's site. Emma knew that I would want to hear about
Miriam Elizabeth's birth, so she let me know.

I'm so pleased for Cyndi - LC has been a literal life saver for her,
and now to have a daughter is just wonderful.

Aramanth

[Marengo]

Priscilla Ballou wrote:

<snip>

||||| Dunno if it's the kidneys that do it, but over 50% of the protein
||||| we ingest is converted to glucose.
|||
||| I wasn't questioning the protein conversion to glucose, I was
||| questioning the kidneys converting it. The kidneys act as filters;
||| the liver acts as a processor. AFAIK.
||
|| OK. We're in agreement then.
||
|| Priscilla
|| --
|| "You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
|| certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in
|| alt.religion.christian.episcopal


Yup. BTW, I love your sig.
--
Peter
Website: http://users.thelink.net/marengo

[Marengo]

RRzVRR wrote:

<snip>
||
|| Under non-dieting, balanced intake conditions, the brain uses
|| around 100g of glucose a day.


Except for JC, of course, who has a much lower fuel demand in that
department ...
<g>
--
Peter
Website: http://users.thelink.net/marengo

[MEow]

Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:

> Ah, yes, induction. Yoghurt is actually much lower in carbs than one
> would think by reading the back of a container in the supermarket.
> Those figures include what went *into* the yoghurt, not what's in the
> cup you're eating from. The cultures digest much of the lactose and
> turn it into lactic acid, which is where the zing comes from. That
> reminds me. I have some milk to use up. I should toss some cream in
> with it and get some yoghurt going.
>
> After induction, you might want to experiment with yoghurt some.
>
You make your own yoghurt? I'm impressed!

>> I know that soy beans have the best Protein/carb ration, but I didn't
>> know if it would be okay. Good to know that it is. I've brought some
>> roasted, salted soy beans to work, to snack on.
>
> You need to know that I'm not doing Atkins or any other formal
> program. To me, anything that's low-carb or otherwise doesn't
> register much on my glucometer is OK by me, although dietary plans
> with names might not agree with what I'm doing. I'm just a type 2
> diabetic controlling my blood glucose through controlled carb intake.
> I "eat to my meter." As a side-effect, I've lost weight and I'm
> continuing to lose, but it's not my primary goal.
>
Sounds good to me - I've sure had a lot of predjudices killed since coming
in here!

> Sounds like you're getting yourself oriented. Good stuff!
>
I managed to make a good dinner based on those lists I found, so I guess
it's low-carb enough. The thing I'm most unsure of is Marmite, though it
looked okay to me...

I'll tell you what I did, so you can tell me if I did something wrong.

I cooked a packet TVP with Marmite and some spices for flavouring, as it's
pretty bland in itself. Then I fried onion and garlic for a while, added
spinach and a sliced leek stalk - let it simmer, added some cream cheese
stirred until it had melted, added a mix of 1/2 cream and 1/2 water - let
it simmer, added the cooked TVP, and tasted with salt, pebber and curry.

It tasted really good, but is it okay on a low-carb diet? If it is, I'll
surely not complain about a diet, which allows food like this. Even my
boyfriend, who's neither vegetarian nor into low-carb liked it.

Sure there's things I miss, but I try to focus on what I *can* eat.

BTW: I was surprised about how hard it was for us to find some cream, which
was not low-fat. They did have one brand, but you had to look for a bit to
find it.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Priscilla H. Ballou]

MEow wrote:
>
> Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:
>
> > After induction, you might want to experiment with yoghurt some.
> >
> You make your own yoghurt? I'm impressed!

It is really REALLY easy. It's easier if you have a gadget like I do
which will keep the stuff at a constant low/warm temperature, but it's
possible with just an oven pilot light.

Mix milk and cream as desired for a total of 2-4 cups.
Heat it to 180 F (kills the bad bugs).
Cool it to under 110 F (makes it hospitable to the good bugs).
Mix in (do not whisk, but I don't know why) either a 1/2 cup of plain
unsweeatened (store-bought or homemade) yoghurt with active cultures or
the appropriate amount (pinch) of dry yoghurt culture from a dairy
supply place. (That's the good bugs.)
Put the result in a low-warm environment (like an unheated oven with a
pilot light) for 8-12 hours. (The bug nursery.)
Eat or put in the fridge and eat later.

I have made this with a heavily-cream mixture, and it is to die for. My
mother practically wept when she heard me offer my sister the jar of it
I had in the fridge. I had to reassure her that I'd make her more. ;-)

> > You need to know that I'm not doing Atkins or any other formal
> > program. To me, anything that's low-carb or otherwise doesn't
> > register much on my glucometer is OK by me, although dietary plans
> > with names might not agree with what I'm doing. I'm just a type 2
> > diabetic controlling my blood glucose through controlled carb intake.
> > I "eat to my meter." As a side-effect, I've lost weight and I'm
> > continuing to lose, but it's not my primary goal.
> >
> Sounds good to me - I've sure had a lot of predjudices killed since coming
> in here!

Not a bad result in and of itself. ;-)

> > Sounds like you're getting yourself oriented. Good stuff!
> >
> I managed to make a good dinner based on those lists I found, so I guess
> it's low-carb enough. The thing I'm most unsure of is Marmite, though it
> looked okay to me...
>
> I'll tell you what I did, so you can tell me if I did something wrong.

/Yoda on
There is no wrong. There is only: next time I'll use less of it.
Yoda off/

> I cooked a packet TVP with Marmite and some spices for flavouring, as it's
> pretty bland in itself. Then I fried onion and garlic for a while, added
> spinach and a sliced leek stalk - let it simmer, added some cream cheese
> stirred until it had melted, added a mix of 1/2 cream and 1/2 water - let
> it simmer, added the cooked TVP, and tasted with salt, pebber and curry.

YUM!

I had to look up TVP, since I don't cook with it myself (although I
think I do have some somewhere in my pantry). Here's what fitday.com
has to say:

Amount Per 1 cup
Total Fat 0.83g 1% *
Cholesterol 0mg 0%
Sodium 13.6mg 1%
Potassium 1621.1mg
Total Carbohydrate 26.09g
*** Dietary Fiber 11.9g
Protein 31.97g 64%

So that works out to 26-12=14 net grams of carb per cup. How much is
there in "a packet?" How much of that went into each serving?

Fitday.com had never heard of Marmite, however
http://www.accomodata.co.uk/marmite.htm has this:

"MARMITE is a concentrated yeast paste, enjoyed at any time of the day,
whether on toast for breakfast, in sandwiches at lunchtime or as an
added ingredient in stews and casseroles.

"MARMITE is 100% vegetarian, but unlike some vegetarian meals, MARMITE
provides an excellent source of vitamin B 12. This vitamin helps to
prevent anaemia. It also contains a good source of Riboflavin and Niacin
as well as an excellent source of Follic Acid.

"MARMITE is good news for the nation's slimmer's. It contains virtually
no fat or sugar. A single 4g serving amounts to only 8 kcal/35 kJ
typical values. Spread on toast with butter this comes to 145 kcal (704
kJ), although skipping the butter cuts the calorie count down to 72 kcal
(350 kJ)."


That doesn't give all the appropriate numbers, but if 4 grams contains 8
calories, that works out to no more than 2 grams of carb (at 4
calories/gram) -- probably less, since I'll betcha there's protein in
there, too. (Carb and protein = 4 calories per gram, fat = 9 calories
per gram.)

The only *possible* iffy bit I'm familiar with would be the amount of
onion, since it can have a few carbs in it. You might want to plug
amounts into fitday.com just as a learning exercise.

> It tasted really good, but is it okay on a low-carb diet? If it is, I'll
> surely not complain about a diet, which allows food like this. Even my
> boyfriend, who's neither vegetarian nor into low-carb liked it.

It sounds fine to me, but there's no low-carb police, and, in my eyes,
there's no "OK" or "not OK." It's about how you're affected by it. You
do need to learn to research nutritional breakdowns of foods. It's
intensive at first, but soon it becomes second nature to reach for one
ingredient instead of another. If you don't want to follow a set
program, try doing lots of research into carb contents of various food
ingredients, eating generally low-carb (say, 30 or fewer grams of carb a
day) for a couple of weeks, see if there are changes in how you feel and
look, and decide if that works for you. You can then increase the
amount per day or stay way low for a while, or whatever feels right to
you. Be aware that the first week of significantly lower carb may make
you feel awful. Headaches, nausea, low energy are all to be expected.
But it passes! Really. It's just your body switching over to burning
fat instead of carbs.

Even if you don't decide to do Atkins, I recommend reading up on what he
says. I learned a lot from this newsgroup about what Atkins says and
what people thinks he says but he really doesn't. There's good general
low-carb knowledge to be gained even if one goes one's own road.

> Sure there's things I miss, but I try to focus on what I *can* eat.

Excellent approach. Perspective is much.

> BTW: I was surprised about how hard it was for us to find some cream, which
> was not low-fat. They did have one brand, but you had to look for a bit to
> find it.

Hmmm. I'm guessing maybe you're not in the US? Terms can vary as one
crosses national boundaries. I'm in Boston, MA, USA, and my grocery
stores have whipping cream, heavy cream, light cream, half and half, and
fat-free half and half (the very thought of which gags me). I generally
have one open quart of heavy cream and one full quart as backup in my fridge.

Sounds like you're approaching this with curiosity and creativity. A
winning combination in my book.

Keep it up!

Priscilla

[None Given]

"Priscilla H. Ballou" > wrote in message
...
> Hmmm. I'm guessing maybe you're not in the US? Terms can vary as one
> crosses national boundaries. I'm in Boston, MA, USA, and my grocery
> stores have whipping cream, heavy cream, light cream, half and half, and
> fat-free half and half (the very thought of which gags me). I generally
> have one open quart of heavy cream and one full quart as backup in my
fridge.


I buy at least 3 quarts of heavy cream when I shop out of town because we
only get the tiny cartons here.

--
No Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes

[Nikitta]

"Priscilla H. Ballou" > wrote in message >...

[Yoghurt making]

I'll try to look more into it at a later point.

> /Yoda on
> There is no wrong. There is only: next time I'll use less of it.
> Yoda off/
>
Don't you mean: "Wrong, there is not. Less of something, to use, next
time, there is", or something like that? ;0)

(Sorry - I couldn't resist! :0))

[TVP]

> So that works out to 26-12=14 net grams of carb per cup. How much is
> there in "a packet?" How much of that went into each serving?
>
One dry packet is 250 g/0,5 lb - I don't know how many cups it is.

The dish I made is good for 4 servings, maybe 5.

I will have time to look more into it during the easter.

> "MARMITE is good news for the nation's slimmer's. It contains virtually
> no fat or sugar. A single 4g serving amounts to only 8 kcal/35 kJ
> typical values. Spread on toast with butter this comes to 145 kcal (704
> kJ), although skipping the butter cuts the calorie count down to 72 kcal
> (350 kJ)."
>
>
> That doesn't give all the appropriate numbers, but if 4 grams contains 8
> calories, that works out to no more than 2 grams of carb (at 4
> calories/gram) -- probably less, since I'll betcha there's protein in
> there, too. (Carb and protein = 4 calories per gram, fat = 9 calories
> per gram.)
>
I looked up "Yeast extract, spread" in the database mentioned in the
FAQ and it looked fine to me. It does contain some proteins too.

> The only *possible* iffy bit I'm familiar with would be the amount of
> onion, since it can have a few carbs in it. You might want to plug
> amounts into fitday.com just as a learning exercise.

Yeah - good idea. I just need to find out how much I weigh and what my
heigt is, converted to feet and inches, so I can sign up. If my height
converts to 5,5 feet and there's 12 inches in one foot, then I'm 5
feet and 6 inches, I think.
>
> > It tasted really good, but is it okay on a low-carb diet? If it is, I'll
> > surely not complain about a diet, which allows food like this. Even my
> > boyfriend, who's neither vegetarian nor into low-carb liked it.
>
> It sounds fine to me, but there's no low-carb police, and, in my eyes,
> there's no "OK" or "not OK." It's about how you're affected by it. You
> do need to learn to research nutritional breakdowns of foods. It's
> intensive at first, but soon it becomes second nature to reach for one
> ingredient instead of another. If you don't want to follow a set
> program, try doing lots of research into carb contents of various food
> ingredients, eating generally low-carb (say, 30 or fewer grams of carb a
> day) for a couple of weeks, see if there are changes in how you feel and
> look, and decide if that works for you. You can then increase the
> amount per day or stay way low for a while, or whatever feels right to
> you. Be aware that the first week of significantly lower carb may make
> you feel awful. Headaches, nausea, low energy are all to be expected.
> But it passes! Really. It's just your body switching over to burning
> fat instead of carbs.
>
I have bit of that, yes. I wouldn't manage to give up caffeine at the
same time as starting this, so I get a bit of help from coffee. Good
thing vacation starts tomorrow, but today there's candy placed all
sorts of places here at work, for people to eat as they please. I do
hope that no one will notice me not eating any; I don't feel like
having to explain why I won't have "Just a little bit". I wish this
work-day would be over soon.

Well - a good thing I've found is that my appetite is already getting
smaller. Just starting with a different breakfast means it takes a lot
longer before I get hungry again. That's good because I tend to have a
fairly big apetite and be hungry quite often.

> Even if you don't decide to do Atkins, I recommend reading up on what he
> says. I learned a lot from this newsgroup about what Atkins says and
> what people thinks he says but he really doesn't. There's good general
> low-carb knowledge to be gained even if one goes one's own road.
>
Yeah. I'll have more time to look much more into it during easter.

> > BTW: I was surprised about how hard it was for us to find some cream, which
> > was not low-fat. They did have one brand, but you had to look for a bit to
> > find it.
>
> Hmmm. I'm guessing maybe you're not in the US? Terms can vary as one
> crosses national boundaries. I'm in Boston, MA, USA, and my grocery
> stores have whipping cream, heavy cream, light cream, half and half, and
> fat-free half and half (the very thought of which gags me). I generally
> have one open quart of heavy cream and one full quart as backup in my fridge.
>
I've better give you the full explanation once and for all: I'm
originally from Denmark, but I live in a small town in the middle of
Sweden (61 degrees north) together with my boyfriend, who's orginally
from Norway.

I've looked up "cream" in www.foodsubs.com , which I think is good for
helping overcome the language barrier. What I bought is close to what
I think you'd call light cream, but what I meant with my comment is
that most of the cream I can find is "New, Low-fat version of your
normal cream!", as people seem to want low-fat versions of their dairy
products a lot...

Kind regards,
Nikitta - googling from work.

[Graphic Queen]

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 19:35:40 +0000 (UTC), MEow >
wrote:

>Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:
>
>> Ah, yes, induction. Yoghurt is actually much lower in carbs than one
>> would think by reading the back of a container in the supermarket.
>> Those figures include what went *into* the yoghurt, not what's in the
>> cup you're eating from. The cultures digest much of the lactose and
>> turn it into lactic acid, which is where the zing comes from. That
>> reminds me. I have some milk to use up. I should toss some cream in
>> with it and get some yoghurt going.
>>
>> After induction, you might want to experiment with yoghurt some.
>>
>You make your own yoghurt? I'm impressed!

It is very easy to make. I make mine all of the time along with
homemade cottage cheese and the like.

GQ
>
>>> I know that soy beans have the best Protein/carb ration, but I didn't
>>> know if it would be okay. Good to know that it is. I've brought some
>>> roasted, salted soy beans to work, to snack on.
>>
>> You need to know that I'm not doing Atkins or any other formal
>> program. To me, anything that's low-carb or otherwise doesn't
>> register much on my glucometer is OK by me, although dietary plans
>> with names might not agree with what I'm doing. I'm just a type 2
>> diabetic controlling my blood glucose through controlled carb intake.
>> I "eat to my meter." As a side-effect, I've lost weight and I'm
>> continuing to lose, but it's not my primary goal.
>>
>Sounds good to me - I've sure had a lot of predjudices killed since coming
>in here!
>
>> Sounds like you're getting yourself oriented. Good stuff!
>>
>I managed to make a good dinner based on those lists I found, so I guess
>it's low-carb enough. The thing I'm most unsure of is Marmite, though it
>looked okay to me...
>
>I'll tell you what I did, so you can tell me if I did something wrong.
>
>I cooked a packet TVP with Marmite and some spices for flavouring, as it's
>pretty bland in itself. Then I fried onion and garlic for a while, added
>spinach and a sliced leek stalk - let it simmer, added some cream cheese
>stirred until it had melted, added a mix of 1/2 cream and 1/2 water - let
>it simmer, added the cooked TVP, and tasted with salt, pebber and curry.
>
>It tasted really good, but is it okay on a low-carb diet? If it is, I'll
>surely not complain about a diet, which allows food like this. Even my
>boyfriend, who's neither vegetarian nor into low-carb liked it.
>
>Sure there's things I miss, but I try to focus on what I *can* eat.
>
>BTW: I was surprised about how hard it was for us to find some cream, which
>was not low-fat. They did have one brand, but you had to look for a bit to
>find it.
>
>Kind regards,
>Nikitta.

[Priscilla H. Ballou]

Nikitta wrote:
>
> "Priscilla H. Ballou" > wrote in message >...

> > /Yoda on
> > There is no wrong. There is only: next time I'll use less of it.
> > Yoda off/
> >
> Don't you mean: "Wrong, there is not. Less of something, to use, next
> time, there is", or something like that? ;0)
>
> (Sorry - I couldn't resist! :0))

LOL! Very good!


[big ole snip]

> > Hmmm. I'm guessing maybe you're not in the US? Terms can vary as one
> > crosses national boundaries. I'm in Boston, MA, USA, and my grocery
> > stores have whipping cream, heavy cream, light cream, half and half, and
> > fat-free half and half (the very thought of which gags me). I generally
> > have one open quart of heavy cream and one full quart as backup in my fridge.
> >
> I've better give you the full explanation once and for all: I'm
> originally from Denmark, but I live in a small town in the middle of
> Sweden (61 degrees north) together with my boyfriend, who's orginally
> from Norway.

Ah! Yes, that explains the difference in terminology/culture.

> I've looked up "cream" in www.foodsubs.com , which I think is good for
> helping overcome the language barrier. What I bought is close to what
> I think you'd call light cream, but what I meant with my comment is
> that most of the cream I can find is "New, Low-fat version of your
> normal cream!", as people seem to want low-fat versions of their dairy
> products a lot...

Oh, dear. Those "low-fat" products that substitute additional carbs for
the fat. *sigh* I wonder if living in a small town is limiting your
grocery options. Is there a larger city fairly accessible that you
could travel to once a month or so? Cream keeps very well (the higher
the butter fat content, the better a dairy product will keep.)

In any event, have good holidays, and happy studying up on this new area
for you!

Priscilla

[MEow]

Priscilla H. Ballou spoke thusly:

> [big ole snip]
>
[One more]

>> I've looked up "cream" in www.foodsubs.com , which I think is good
>> for helping overcome the language barrier. What I bought is close to
>> what I think you'd call light cream, but what I meant with my comment
>> is that most of the cream I can find is "New, Low-fat version of your
>> normal cream!", as people seem to want low-fat versions of their
>> dairy products a lot...
>
> Oh, dear. Those "low-fat" products that substitute additional carbs
> for the fat. *sigh*

Yeah. Exactly. I need to browse the shelves for a bit before managing to
find any normal stuff. I didn't realise that how much of that "low-fat"
stuff, and how little of the normal stuff, there was before I started on
this diet.

>I wonder if living in a small town is limiting
> your grocery options. Is there a larger city fairly accessible that
> you could travel to once a month or so? Cream keeps very well (the
> higher the butter fat content, the better a dairy product will keep.)

There is a much bigger city about one hour away by bus, which we go to
once in a while to buy stuff, and to get the hell out of this little
small-town for a while. I'll want to go there and check if they have a
decent Asian food-shop, because I'd love some proper, Asian tofu. The
stuff the health-food shops sell is good, but nothing beats proper, Asian
tofu - I'd happily fry up a few slices of that for breakfast, or a snack.

Meanwhile I've looked into coconut milk, which I really enjoy, and as far
as I can tell, it's just fine.
>
> In any event, have good holidays, and happy studying up on this new
> area for you!
>
Thanks. Good holiday-wishes to you too.

I've just found out that I can drink flavoured club soda, which is good
because though I like water, and drink it a lot, it gets boring in the
long run to have nothing else, and I can't stand the taste of diet sodas.

Currently I'm seeking for some more snack-ideas - especially for work.
Nuts seem to contain a lot more carbs than I thought.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article 8>,
MEow > wrote:

> Currently I'm seeking for some more snack-ideas - especially for work.
> Nuts seem to contain a lot more carbs than I thought.

Check into olives and pickles (not the sweet ones). I often have a dish
of black olives as my afternoon snack, and sucking on a nice dill pickle
can be very satisfying when the mouth wants something lively.

I do eat some nuts, because they're so good for one in different ways,
but I don't overdo it. Also peanuts. Cheeses are good. What a treat
to have a lot of Brie on a very few water crackers! Berries are a
treat, and much lower-carb than most other fruits.

Then there's stuff like celery stuffed with cream cheese (or cream
cheese mixed with a little blue cheese), and other raw vegies.

Oh, dear. This is making me hungry! :-)

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[MEow]

Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:

[Snacks]

> Oh, dear. This is making me hungry! :-)
>

Good ideas - thanks. It's very confusing, this, and it seems that
different sources contradict each other regarding the nutrtional value of
foods, though it might just be me being confused by them using so
different units, and even though I've tried to look into this "Net-carb"
thing, I still don't quite get it.

I can't find out if capers are okay or not and try as I might, I can't
wrap my head around the difference in carbs between raw and cooked
broccoli, let alone figure out if it's a bad idea that I eat it...

My apetite seems to be going up again, and a lot of the time I have the
confusing feeling of feeling both full and hungry at the same time. I
sure as hell hope that will go away soon.

I'll see if I feel better by Tuesday when it's time to go back to work...

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Nicky]

"MEow" > wrote in message
97.138...
> I can't find out if capers are okay or not and try as I might, I can't
> wrap my head around the difference in carbs between raw and cooked
> broccoli, let alone figure out if it's a bad idea that I eat it...

You're unlikely to eat enough capers to make a difference. And broccoli is
great for you, raw or cooked. (The difference in carbs is probably because
it squishes down a bit when it's cooked.)

Nicky.

--
A1c 10.5/4.5/<6 Weight 95/77/72Kg
1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine
T2 DX 05/2004

[MEow]

Nicky spoke thusly:

> You're unlikely to eat enough capers to make a difference. And
> broccoli is great for you, raw or cooked. (The difference in carbs is
> probably because it squishes down a bit when it's cooked.)
>
Of course! I keep forgetting that you measure things by volume, as opposed
to by weight, as I'm used to. That explains it!

Thanks for solving this for me!
(And great news, because I like Broccoli a lot!)

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article 8>,
MEow > wrote:

> I can't find out if capers are okay or not and try as I might, I can't
> wrap my head around the difference in carbs between raw and cooked
> broccoli, let alone figure out if it's a bad idea that I eat it...

The difference between counts for raw vs. cooked is usually the
difference between how much of the stuff you can cram into a cup (or
other unit of measure). Cooked foods tend to pack in easier. The carb
count of the food doesn't change, just the volume of the food in the
measuring unit. That help?

Now, GI (glycemic index) may change, but if you're just low-carbing and
not controlling BG via diet, who cares? ;-)

> My apetite seems to be going up again, and a lot of the time I have the
> confusing feeling of feeling both full and hungry at the same time. I
> sure as hell hope that will go away soon.

Have a nice big glass of liquid with your meals?

> I'll see if I feel better by Tuesday when it's time to go back to work...

Hang in there!

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[Priscilla Ballou]

In article 8>,
MEow > wrote:

> Nicky spoke thusly:
>
> > You're unlikely to eat enough capers to make a difference. And
> > broccoli is great for you, raw or cooked. (The difference in carbs is
> > probably because it squishes down a bit when it's cooked.)
> >
> Of course! I keep forgetting that you measure things by volume, as opposed
> to by weight, as I'm used to. That explains it!
>
> Thanks for solving this for me!
> (And great news, because I like Broccoli a lot!)

IMO broccoli is close to the perfect food. Most days one of the
brassicas is on my dinner plate -- broccoli or cauliflower or brussels
sprouts or cabbage.

Priscilla
--
"You can't welcome someone into a body of Christ and then say only
certain rooms are open." -- dancertm in alt.religion.christian.episcopal

[Luna]

In article >,
Priscilla Ballou > wrote:

> In article 8>,
> MEow > wrote:
>
> > Nicky spoke thusly:
> >
> > > You're unlikely to eat enough capers to make a difference. And
> > > broccoli is great for you, raw or cooked. (The difference in carbs is
> > > probably because it squishes down a bit when it's cooked.)
> > >
> > Of course! I keep forgetting that you measure things by volume, as opposed
> > to by weight, as I'm used to. That explains it!
> >
> > Thanks for solving this for me!
> > (And great news, because I like Broccoli a lot!)
>
> IMO broccoli is close to the perfect food. Most days one of the
> brassicas is on my dinner plate -- broccoli or cauliflower or brussels
> sprouts or cabbage.
>
> Priscilla

I feel that way about spinach. Though I like broccoli a lot too.
Sometimes I can't decide which I want, so I have a half portion of each.

[MEow]

Priscilla Ballou spoke thusly:

>> My apetite seems to be going up again, and a lot of the time I have
>> the confusing feeling of feeling both full and hungry at the same
>> time. I sure as hell hope that will go away soon.
>
> Have a nice big glass of liquid with your meals?
>
I generally drink a lot of liquid - most of it being water. I'm a thirsty
girl, me. I don't always drink something together with my meal, but then
I do after. Maybe my feeling of thirst has gone down, so I drink less -
I'll keep an eye on it.

I look forward to being able to drink milk again, in nine days.

>> I'll see if I feel better by Tuesday when it's time to go back to
>> work...
>
> Hang in there!
>
Thanks. I'm slowly getting better, and I must be doing *something* right,
because today I found that I could take off my trousers without opening
the zipper and good thing, too; I had to pee, and the zipper got stuck!

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Nicky]

"Luna" > wrote in message
...
> I feel that way about spinach. Though I like broccoli a lot too.
> Sometimes I can't decide which I want, so I have a half portion of each.

ROFL! Me too! Occasionally zucchini muscle in there too...

Nicky.

--
A1c 10.5/4.5/<6 Weight 95/77/72Kg
1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine
T2 DX 05/2004

[MEow]

Priscilla H. Ballou spoke thusly:

> I had to look up TVP, since I don't cook with it myself (although I
> think I do have some somewhere in my pantry). Here's what fitday.com
> has to say:
>
> Amount Per 1 cup
> Total Fat 0.83g 1% *
> Cholesterol 0mg 0%
> Sodium 13.6mg 1%
> Potassium 1621.1mg
> Total Carbohydrate 26.09g
> *** Dietary Fiber 11.9g
> Protein 31.97g 64%
>
> So that works out to 26-12=14 net grams of carb per cup. How much is
> there in "a packet?" How much of that went into each serving?
>
Now I've finally measured it: one packet is about 4 cups and gives 4
servings. That gives 14 g net carbs pr serving. Not good considering that
I'm still within the first 2 weeks... even if it *does* keep me full for
hours :0( and please don't ask me to just eat smaller servings, because
I'd never be able to follow a diet where I can't eat until I'm full and I
can't just lower how much it takes for me to get full...

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[MEow]

MEow spoke thusly:

I've thought about it and decided to give up; there's no way in hell I'll get
under 20g carbs a day - try as I might, and I did give it a serious try.

Thanks for your help - most especially Priscilla. I'll think about some of
the things you've said, and eat a lot less carb-heavy than I did before, but
that induction with less than 20 g carbs/day is not going to happen for me.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Priscilla H. Ballou]

MEow wrote:
>
> Now I've finally measured it: one packet is about 4 cups and gives 4
> servings. That gives 14 g net carbs pr serving. Not good considering that
> I'm still within the first 2 weeks... even if it *does* keep me full for
> hours :0( and please don't ask me to just eat smaller servings, because
> I'd never be able to follow a diet where I can't eat until I'm full and I
> can't just lower how much it takes for me to get full...

That's cool. Maybe just wait to repeat that recipe until you're out of
induction? ;-)

Have you tried playing with black soy beans yet? I'll bet you could
work up a fine and filling dish using those as an ingredient.

Priscilla

[Priscilla H. Ballou]

MEow wrote:
>
> MEow spoke thusly:
>
> I've thought about it and decided to give up; there's no way in hell I'll get
> under 20g carbs a day - try as I might, and I did give it a serious try.
>
> Thanks for your help - most especially Priscilla. I'll think about some of
> the things you've said, and eat a lot less carb-heavy than I did before, but
> that induction with less than 20 g carbs/day is not going to happen for me.

Whoa! Who says you have to do induction? Atkins is not God and does
not define all low-carbing!

Priscilla

[MEow]

Priscilla H. Ballou spoke thusly:

> Whoa! Who says you have to do induction? Atkins is not God and does
> not define all low-carbing!
>
I thought it was common for all low-carb diets and pretty much a key-
point. Well - then I'll give it a try for at least a while yet. I'm
feeling fine and was very glad to drink a large glas of milk - that also
has a satiating effect on me - at least the regular milk does.

That's the second time you've kept me from giving up in just a little
more than a week! Your support and encouragement really helps me a lot!
Thank you!

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Priscilla H. Ballou]

MEow wrote:
>
> Priscilla H. Ballou spoke thusly:
>
> > Whoa! Who says you have to do induction? Atkins is not God and does
> > not define all low-carbing!
> >
> I thought it was common for all low-carb diets and pretty much a key-
> point.

Atkins and, I believe, South Beach have it, but so what? I don't like
to let self-appointed authorities define my reality for me. It may
possibly (POSSIBLY) work better with induction, but that doesn't mean it
doesn't work at all without it!

> Well - then I'll give it a try for at least a while yet. I'm
> feeling fine and was very glad to drink a large glas of milk - that also
> has a satiating effect on me - at least the regular milk does.

Heck, just reducing the quantity of carb in your diet is bound to be
making it healthier. Go for it!

> That's the second time you've kept me from giving up in just a little
> more than a week! Your support and encouragement really helps me a lot!
> Thank you!

You're welcome. Are you generally an impulsive person? I feel like I've
been catching you by your shirt-tails as you dash off. ;-) Slow down!
Chill! Try things out. No need to rush into or out of anything.

Priscilla

[MEow]

Priscilla H. Ballou spoke thusly:

>> Well - then I'll give it a try for at least a while yet. I'm
>> feeling fine and was very glad to drink a large glas of milk - that
>> also has a satiating effect on me - at least the regular milk does.
>
> Heck, just reducing the quantity of carb in your diet is bound to be
> making it healthier. Go for it!
>
I feel fine with this diet as it is now, though I'm I'm not looking
forward to visiting my family back in Demark and getting them to
understand and accept this new diet. Of course I look forward to seeing
them, but I think you know what I mean... Well - they already accept me
being vegetarian, so it might not be so bad...

Odd thing I've noticed about milk, BTW: you'd expect low-fat milks to
have more carbs, but according the the milk carton it's not so - The
mini-milk with 0,5 % fat has the same amount of carbs as the one with 3%
fat. I'll drink the one with 3% as it satiates me more, but it still
puzzles me. The youghur naturell I just bought, also with 3% fat has
exactly the same amount of catbs as the two others (5 g pr 100 g). A
yoghurt I saw with 10% fat had 4,2 g carbs pr 100 g when I'd expect it
to differ much more.

Not that I worry about it - I just wonder, and I don't get it.

>> That's the second time you've kept me from giving up in just a little
>> more than a week! Your support and encouragement really helps me a
>> lot! Thank you!
>
> You're welcome. Are you generally an impulsive person? I feel like
> I've been catching you by your shirt-tails as you dash off. ;-) Slow
> down! Chill! Try things out. No need to rush into or out of
> anything.
>
According to my boyfriend - kind of, yes. Well - I would have never met
him if it wasn't for some degree of impulsiveness, but that's a
different story ;0)

Kind regards,
Nikitta.

[Priscilla H. Ballou]

MEow wrote:
>
> Odd thing I've noticed about milk, BTW: you'd expect low-fat milks to
> have more carbs, but according the the milk carton it's not so - The
> mini-milk with 0,5 % fat has the same amount of carbs as the one with 3%
> fat. I'll drink the one with 3% as it satiates me more, but it still
> puzzles me.

It's probably rounding and serving size and so on. Check out fitday.
There is a difference, albeit not a huge one.

> The youghur naturell I just bought, also with 3% fat has
> exactly the same amount of catbs as the two others (5 g pr 100 g). A
> yoghurt I saw with 10% fat had 4,2 g carbs pr 100 g when I'd expect it
> to differ much more.

I thought I'd said something about this before. ??? The numbers on
yoghurt containers are for what they put *into* the yoghurt, not for
what results. The cultures eat much of the lactose (milk sugar)
creating lactic acid. So the carbs go down as it gets zingier.'

Priscilla

[Nikitta]

"Priscilla H. Ballou" > wrote in message >...

> > The youghur naturell I just bought, also with 3% fat has
> > exactly the same amount of catbs as the two others (5 g pr 100 g). A
> > yoghurt I saw with 10% fat had 4,2 g carbs pr 100 g when I'd expect it
> > to differ much more.
>
> I thought I'd said something about this before. ??? The numbers on
> yoghurt containers are for what they put *into* the yoghurt, not for
> what results. The cultures eat much of the lactose (milk sugar)
> creating lactic acid. So the carbs go down as it gets zingier.'
>
Ah - I wasn't sure of what you meant by that. Thanks for clearing it
up. I should've just used my head a bit.

Kind regards,
Nikitta.